Yuan Yunsheng, Professor, Central Academy of Fine Arts

Professor Yuan: I think he just doesn’t know how to protect himself, nor does he have a strong awareness of self-protection, because I think he sets all his mind, and feelings, to art. People like him tend to lack the capability of self-protection in the modern world. You see, there have been so many opportunities. If he worked a bit harder on it, he could have done it. All he wants is to create works. It’s not that he doesn’t want to. In fact, he doesn’t seize the opportunity. He is not good at protecting himself or fighting for something. He wouldn’t, even want a better condition if it was given. Often, when he encounters such a condition, he continues working on his own, making the effort alone. He enjoys that. He doesn’t argue with anyone, or fight for the condition or position he deserves. He would not do this kind of thing. In this regard, he is by no means eloquent. 

During my association with him, that’s how he impresses me. You’d figure out what makes him happy, what catches his attention, and what he doesn’t understand at all, if you associate with him. 

Reporter: What catches his attention?

Professor Yuan: For example, when a student made something that showed potential, he would be very happy. When a student was committed to the creation, it made him happy, too. He didn’t talk a lot of theories, but just sculpted away. He left the students to their sculpting as well. He rarely talked theories, because that kind of sculpture, the smaller ones, could be mastered once you knew the basics. Different people put in different levels of effort. He commented on what was well done and gave some advice for improvement. But he wouldn’t dwell on grand theories. I think he is a very down-to-earth person.

Reporter: How was his relationship with the students?

Professor Yuan: Very good. The students liked him very much. When he saw the students go for sculpture in the morning, in the afternoon, and the next day, he felt very happy. When the students asked him questions, he was always patient to answer them. He stopped whatever he was doing and talked with the students. He was always passionate about art, totally devoted.

Reporter: Is there anything that makes you believe that he is indifferent to fame and fortune? The small electric kiln?

Professor Yuan: This is very clear. He had worked here for more than ten years. It wasn’t that he shouldn’t have taught, because teaching was meaningful for the Academy at that stage. But he could have advertised himself, or promoted his sculptures. Nonetheless he rarely did that.  You know, in the 1980s and 1990s, the trend or the situation in China didn’t really resonate with his style, which was simple and down to earth. He would not pretend to be fascinated about modernism. He wouldn’t do that because it was not what he wanted to do. He would not become a representative of academism either. From the “Splitting Mountains for Water” which he created at a young age, we can see that he is not this kind of person at all. He is not someone who would like academia which is rigorous, or equals realism. He never pursued that. To be fair, he had exceptional basic skills, which was why his teachers liked him so much and had such high hopes for him. But his interest in art was different. 

Of course, these things sublimated as he matured, as he had all the life experience, including his time in the Forbidden City, and his time in the National Museum of Chinese History (now the National Museum of China). All of these enriched his overall understanding of the culture. He is a simple person himself. He was born with a love for art, just like he loves Henan Bangzi. Moreover, he likes farmers and the life of farmers. He feels an affinity with the character of farmers. I think he is this kind of person that while interacting with people, he never thinks too much about himself, for example what would be the gains or losses. He wouldn’t consider these. So, there are not many people who are really close to him, not even among colleagues, because his attitude towards life is very different, and his views on artworks are also different.

Reporter: His current works… After the “Splitting the Mountains to Let the Water Flow”, he made more sculptures. He must have made a choice. He must have come to this day step by step, partly forced by the circumstances.

Professor Yuan: I think this is completely his own choice. These works record his real emotions and feelings. You can see he’s extremely interested in local operas, and the stories within. If he only read foreign novels, he would not have such an attitude, let alone follow the trends. Not to mention local operas, even Peking Opera which few students who majored in Sculpture in the Academy liked, as local operas has a lower social status than Peking Opera. Liu’s sincere passion, or his style, has a natural affinity with the soil of China and the folk culture of China. 

Reporter: If he were a shrewd person, he wouldn’t be able to achieve all this.

Professor Yuan: A real artist is often situated in unfavourable circumstances. There’s some truth in it. What art requires is opposite to what life requires him to act or perform. It is almost destined that such a person shall encounter unfavourable circumstances. Although it doesn’t apply to everyone, but I believe the situation is very unlikely. With followers of trends, what Liu has been doing would be considered bizarre, even to fellow sculptors. But Liu is indifferent to that. He doesn’t care. He doesn’t want praise. Only people like him can persevere. If a person always cares how others see him, whether he is fashionable enough or not, whether he is modern enough or not, or is always mindful of what he says, if he cares about all of this, he can’t persevere. There wouldn’t be what constitutes Liu Shiming today. In fact, wasn’t Vincent van Gogh like this as well? Gustave Moreau and Paul Gauguin were like this, too.

Among Chinese painters, Xu Wei and Chen Laolian were also the same. Liu’s life is full of ups and downs. He is definitely not dumb. His heart is not there. He can’t handle things like this. He is often situated in such circumstances, such unfavourable circumstances, which however made his art possible. That’s it. I think this kind of thing is more or less the same in China or abroad, in the past or present. Not to mention things like political persecution, even if we just look at the passion and life, he cannot escape such situations when he’s engaged in society.

Reporter: As the saying in the United States goes, the so-called artists are all vulnerable.

Professor Yuan: The people that are out of place, basically.

Reporter: Artists nowadays desire to be bright and shiny, fashionable, wealthy, and bourgeois.

Professor Yuan: To be an idolater, or a star for others to follow, that is different. This has nothing to do with art.

Reporter: Worldly things cannot help being a bit superficial. There isn’t much involved in real art. The artist should stay in his own studio. The current scene is too social.

Professor Yuan: This condition sounds easy but in reality, it is not easy to achieve. For many people, it is difficult to achieve.

Reporter: The kind that is easy to pursue…

Professor Yuan: It’s in his nature, I think it’s a matter of nature.

Reporter: Nature plus external temptation.

Professor Yuan: Yes.

Reporter: In the Academy, he had a small room with his electric kiln. He did not fight for anything better. He was willing to stay there, without salary, and he rode a tricycle.

Professor Yuan: I think he was probably thinking like this at that time. It doesn’t matter if I lost everything, but I must preserve the relationship between this electric kiln and me now. He would think like this first and foremost. Even when the schedule was prolonged, only with this basic condition could he continue to create. He could fire his sculptures there. If this was what he really cared about, he would demand that of himself, instead of pursuing other things which were beyond his capacity. That’s why despite the poor conditions, he could be like that. If even this didn’t exist, he wouldn’t have the conditions to create. 

Everyone pursues different things. From a certain point of view, it’s difficult to understand his way of dealing with people and things.
In my opinion, he’s like this. What he valued most in his heart was the opportunity for him to create. In the early 1980s, it was impossible to build a kiln on your own to fire things. Back then, what seems easy now was impossible. Besides, his physical condition was not very good, and his economic conditions couldn’t be good. What do you think he would consider? I think that was completely understandable. He couldn’t cause any trouble.

Because he was vigorous, he is a winner in art. But in life, he’s utterly weak. He suffers from sickness, and he can’t protect himself. I think as an artist, he’s lucky with this, and perhaps also unlucky with this. 

Reporter: True artists are almost the same in this respect, no matter what country or region they live in.

Professor Yuan: The same, basically.

Reporter: You can create only in that state. When social demand is concerned, he is flawed, otherwise people like him would not strive for fame and fortune. Art is also a way to express life and society.

Professor Yuan: In other words, what is it? Art itself demands this, that the artist is vigorous, and that he isn’t demanding on the matters of survival, benefits, and circumstances. If these two demands are not balanced or met, it is impossible for the artist to continue his art. Under many conditions, it’s difficult in the end for people to make the choice. He must face it truthfully. These are the fundamental matters. He must figure out before he can be an artist. If he can’t figure it out, he would have probably abandoned art at some point.

Reporter: Can’t resist the temptation?

Professor Yuan: Right.

Reporter: Why did he work so hard for the next fifteen years? You just said that this was the state he was in. It is not that there was any time before that, or opportunity.

Professor Yuan: How could he have so much time? When he was there before, the circumstances didn’t give him the opportunity. He had a job, restoration work. He spent all his working hours on art. When he was on the job, he worked on something related to that. He would protect that. He would make sure of that. 

His salary was very low. It was very difficult to support his family with that salary.

Reporter: Perhaps he sold some sculptures to make a living. Afterwards he had no salary.

Professor Yuan: I don’t even know what happened to his financial situation.

Reporter: You know what? Within that decade or so, he had a salary for a few years, and then he stopped teaching part-time, so gradually the payment stopped. That means, he did not have a salary for over ten years after that. He went there every day by tricycle, but not a penny was paid. He was basically separate from the school, and merely making ends meet. 

Professor Yuan: He wasn’t sent away.

Reporter: Right. That’s what happened. I think different people have different blessings. He’s pretty weird now. His son is doing well, and quite wealthy. 

Professor Yuan: His old age isn’t bad at all.

Reporter: Did he ride a tricycle every day?

Professor Yuan: I was abroad at that time, and I didn’t know about that at all. I was in the US from 1982 to 1996.

Reporter: You understand a little about his stuff.

Professor Yuan: I am very interested in his thinking and artworks, so I invited him to teach.

Reporter: Do you know why your invitation meant so much to him? 

Professor Yuan: It appeared to me that he was passionate about sculpture, but I had little idea about his circumstances. I think his son was doing a bit better, because his son was able to drive him here. When and how it started, I’m not so sure. When I first went to visit him at home to extend the invitation, he was living in a tiny house. After a few years, he had a house in the Asian Games Village. The conditions were better. His child was obviously in better economic condition. At first when I invited him to teach here, his life was very difficult because he could only come to school when his son was free to drive him. Later, there was a time when he came and chatted very happily. Because I didn’t have a car either, I couldn’t pick him up.

Reporter: Let’s talk about his value. Should he have something in contemporary Chinese sculpture?

Professor Yuan: I think the most important thing is that the current era really needs people like him. In sculpture, for example, in art education and art creation, there should be people like him to stay on the path, and this path is something that can connect with his own nation and the entire cultural context, and that can sustain, and develop. Such is the path. I think he is like this and has become important in the current era.

Now we are not commenting on each of his sculptures. I think this is a different matter which may involve the overall art evaluation. We may talk about each of his works in detail, but I think this is where his significance lies in, which is very much needed especially at this stage. Of course, we can see in his works how he feels intimate, interesting, and full of the emotions of life. Such works are very imaginative. Of course, he can do it. Of course, he is a very skilled artist, mastering artistic language. A superb artist should really be evaluated in the nation’s historical context. This is not my area of expertise. It may be the business of future art historians who will make evaluations. 

I still believe that such an artist in the current era shall ground the current era in a way, maintain a strong connection with his own culture, and seek development from this. I think this is a very important matter. Especially when modern young people consider their direction in art, I think they should think about this matter.

Reporter: You first met each other when you were studying in the Academy?

Professor Yuan: Actually, I had heard about him before going to the Academy. Back in 1958, the sculpture at the entrance of Zhongshan Park, “Splitting the Mountains to Let the Water Flow”, was created by him. The sculpture attracted so much attention. It was full of imagination. It was in 1980 when I returned to the Central Academy of Fine Arts. He returned at the same time. Later, the Academy built two small rooms for me to live in whereas his house had a kiln on top for pottery. Since then, I became very interested in him but I went abroad from 1982 through to 1996. Later, I came across his exhibition at the Department of Sculpture and I was interested in it, thus I approached him and said that I hoped you can teach a bit in our studio, teach pottery sculpture. He was very interested. For several years, I had him teaching in my studio, and we got closer.

Reporter: After you spent so many years abroad, what do you think of his works when you came back?

Professor Yuan: Before I went to the United States, I wrote an article entitled “Regeneration”. That was in 1982. I went to the United States because they invited me to be a visiting artist. Besides, I worked on murals in China back then. The one about the Water Splashing Festival made it very difficult. Since there was something related to it was considered wrong. I thought if I continued to work in the Department of Mural Painting, a section chief could get rid of me, because of my mural on Water Splashing Festival. Going abroad might at least leave me with some time to create something. In addition, I wanted to learn about Western culture, Western modern art, and what the Western way of thinking was like. So, I stayed in the university for a fairly long time. I stayed at Harvard University for four years. Also, I made a big mural there. I kept China and ancient Chinese art on my mind. They were attractive to me. When I studied about the West, I also looked back on the path we had travelled on in the past century. When I came back and gave the first speech to the students in the Academy, I proposed that Chinese artists and the students in Chinese art academies should spare no effort in understanding and studying our own traditional art, and blaze a trail from it, so that we would not become an appendage of Western art. When I saw Mr. Liu’s painting, it clicked immediately. We soon shared a lot of common ideas. I admired him for always staying on his artistic path. Meanwhile, he spent some time in the Palace Museum and some more time in the National Museum of Chinese History. He had seen and worked on so many ancient Chinese artworks, so we shared a considerable common language. Thus, I followed him closely. I found his works fascinating. Among his sculptures, like these, the ones he gave me back then gave off an air pertaining to Chinese people.

Speaking of the air of Chinese art, we had a lot to discuss, lots of topics to cover. I had followed him closely. I tried to convince him to create a large sculpture in China. I made some effort but I didn’t succeed. I was thinking about an urban sculpture, a relatively large urban sculpture. I know he was not in good health at that time. Every time he went to our studio to teach, his son drove him there. He supported himself with two walking sticks. I think he should leave a large piece of work that echoed the “Splitting Mountains for Water” which he created in 1958. He was fully capable of creating excellent sculptures, much more interesting than many of the urban sculptures we see now. It would be a Chinese sculpture. But that didn’t work out, unfortunately.

I always feel that the path that Mr. Liu takes… considering his stamina now… he doesn’t have a studio. He makes some sculptures in his relatively small house. Of course, he can only make smaller sculptures, definitely not because he can’t make large ones but he doesn’t have the opportunity. The current fickle era demands something that looks fashionable, so he was neglected. I feel very unfair about this, but there is nothing I can do. No one invites him. But he is fine. He is in a good mood now. He keeps creating. A while ago, he gave me a Jigong [a character in Chinese folk culture]. He has always stayed connected with Chinese culture and Chinese sculpture art, and he has been practising, so more and more interesting works can be expected. I believe he is a very important star in the circle of sculpture in China, and his works are highly significant. It is a pity that we have this current situation that there are too many problems with art trends. Liu’s works, and his ideas, have no chance to develop. You call me to talk about Mr. Liu, and I am very happy to do that, because I think China now needs artists like him to play a role at a critical juncture in the development of Chinese art.

Reporter: If the so-called fashion is the mainstream in current art fields, if this is the case, Liu’s work would be considered uninteresting and dismissed. I wonder why you don’t think so… that his works are small works? 

Professor Yuan: It’s not like that. What matters is not the size, but the idea. Liu’s works are not art created for salons; they are real feelings, a manifestation of himself, an expression. In essence, his sculptures are highly valuable. The problem is that now people seem to consider that only by completing a large urban sculpture, one has made an artwork. This is the blind spot at the moment, a blind spot on how people understand the issue. If Liu’s works were enlarged, and they become large artworks. The size doesn’t matter at all.

Reporter: His works are more on the technical side?

Professor Yuan: That’s not how people comment on him. Liu has done in-depth research on Chinese culture. He has spent a long time on replication and restoration in the Palace Museum. That’s a very good process to learn about the Chinese culture and delve deep. Such a process is very important for an artist, imagine that the opportunity presents itself. Besides, when he was young, he was a student of Wang Linyi. Wang was a Chinese artist who had studied in France, but he followed closely Chinese culture and Chinese sculpture art. I remember Liu mentioned that he met Wang once before he died. Wang told him to learn about the art in Sui Dynasty [581-618], the sculpture in Sui Dynasty. In fact, I feel the same way about the sculpture in Sui Dynasty. I believe that was a significant stage. The style was unique in Chinese history. Basically, between the Northern Dynasties [386-581] and Tang Dynasty [618-907], Sui lasted over three decades and served as a crucial link that summarised the art in the Northern Dynasties and advanced it to the Tang Dynasty. In the art history alongside world history, artworks at the turning points tend to bear a unique significance. A prerequisite though is a comparatively clear direction of development. The stage where China now stands should be a very good stage, in the sense that China has reached the current stage from the previous one, and China shall continue to move forward with its art development. This should be a very good stage, where someone must find a way to move Chinese art forward. Artists must work with the Chinese foundation but not transform ourselves by Western standards. Down this road, there must be major accomplishments. Regrettably, so much is by Western standards now, and there are the fickle and herd behaviour. The worst is happening in China at this moment, in our times. This is what I consider most pathetic. 

Reporter: Liu appears particularly valuable right now.

Professor Yuan: Yes, exactly.

Reporter: You stayed abroad for a long time… There’s a kind of understanding abroad that any piece of artwork is related to the artist’s life experience. If Vincent van Gogh hadn’t experienced all the ups and downs, the artistic value of his paintings would not have been so great.

Professor Yuan: This is actually the case. In fact, in art development, all artworks no matter what type must relate to the artist like flesh and blood. There’s an authentic, humble and intrinsic connection with the artists’ life, feelings, and thoughts. The artworks thus come alive. If we build any artwork on the basis of any idea proposed by someone else, or try to align the artwork with such an idea, the artwork would be lifeless. The greatest thing about Mr. Liu is that all his artworks come from his feelings, his personal life, his spiritual support and his expression, so they are real and simple. There’s the intrinsic connection between such art and the life of ordinary people. There’s a spiritual connection that runs very deep with the current times. So is such a connection with culture.

I think this is very important. In modern and current times, some stumbled on the way forward amidst all the imbalances as they tried to stay away from the vulgar or fashionable things or to resist the material pursuit. That’s completely different. I believe Liu is able to be grounded in current times. When one lives a relatively normal life, his art doesn’t become valuable when he sings in an extremely high key. In other words, the art doesn’t become valuable only because it’s new, brought by others from elsewhere, so trendy and high-profile. No, I don’t think it should work like that. 

Reporter: The first time you saw Liu’s works was at the exhibition in CAFA?

Professor Yuan: That was when I saw many of his works. 

Reporter: What did you think of the exhibition there? Do you remember what it was like? I’m not sure about the situation then. 
Professor Yuan: When I saw his works, I felt a resonance. I felt an intense affinity when I suddenly saw a certain image in his works. I could see his thinking behind it. He might be reminiscing, imagining the expression related to his life. So, it seemed simple and approachable, and thus refreshing. When everyone was so fickle at that time, or began to be fickle and not at the current level yet, not at the level of money worship, I thought that was quite admirable. Back then, I could already feel that he had his unique value in the sculpture department, in this circle of art. 

Not my circle, but in the Department of Sculpture.

Reporter: He taught for two years, and stopped?

Professor Yuan: It’s a pity.

Reporter: People thought it was about time for him to go, not stay there. Do you know much about him at that time?

Professor Yuan: Because I had been away since 1982, I only learned that part from him. I heard that he stayed beside the kiln for fifteen years. It was pretty sad for the Academy. When Liu was clearly energetic, he wasn’t enabled to do his best in the Department of Sculpture, CAFA, which I think was really a pity. It was not until that exhibition when someone started to see the value of these works, or the value of the path he’s been taking all along, alone. I think it was very late. You see, that was already 1997.

I stayed abroad for more than ten years. My strongest feeling is that we should follow them during the first step. I think Chinese culture encompasses a very large system, a very valuable system. The same is true for the art and culture. For example, as I do sculpture investigation now, I see copious marvellous works in every province, and those works are by no means conservative as we would imagine in the first place. The history of Chinese sculpture art is an inclusive one. It is full of creativity and whimsical as they found their way into the artworks. These artworks are mature. If you ignore the history, the achievements in this part of history, that would be your own loss. That’s how the current generation makes me sad. 

Liu is a very romantic person, and his whole life is very interesting. When he left the sculpture factory and went to Henan, it was for love. Working in the sculpture factory back then would be like working in a sculpture research institute. That was a job hard to come by. Yet, he gave it up and went to Henan following his love. He is a very romantic sculptor. He is an artist by nature. I often felt this after I came back and spent time with him. Also, when he taught in my studio, his attitude to the students, the kind of affinity, and the calm and open attitude in discussions, and his outlook on life gave the impression that this person was a natural artist. He was not pretentious at all. His works also reflected that. I liked his sculptures very much.

Reporter: What kind of artist is a natural artist? What should he be like?

Professor Yuan: First, his character determines his art style. He doesn’t try to transform and conform to anything. There are all types of people. Liu Shiming should be just like Liu Shiming. What he has been doing all his life is what Liu Shiming should have been doing. With better conditions, he could have created larger and more sculptures, and sculptures that have a greater impact on society. Without such conditions, he came to terms with the existing conditions. Despite this situation, a very difficult situation, he made a lot of sculptures. In those fifteen years, he made so many sculptures. He was almost like a boiler worker. His desire to create was not hampered by the circumstances. He continued creating. This one fact alone is admirable. Didn’t you just mention Vincent van Gogh? Van Gogh had none of his paintings sold during his lifetime. He didn’t feel painful because of this. He felt calmness in his heart so long as he could continue painting. Therefore, an artist shouldn’t be known for the superficial so-called success, as in how high his status is, how much money he has, how many people crowd around him, etc. That’s useless. I think Liu is very clear on this.

He is not after this. He doesn’t care. That’s why he can continue to create. And the optimism and romance in his works are worth cherishing. He does not complain. There is no sorrow in his works. They don’t appear indignant. He doesn’t hold anything like this. He remains cheerful, which is rare. So, I say that he is a true artist. It is impossible to fake it. No one challenges him. No one cares about him. He’s there alone. After a while, I asked Liu if he had any new sculptures as I had some ideas. He was always so cheerful, despite his poor health and other unfavourable conditions. That’s so admirable. True artist. That’s what I mean by true artists. He is one with his art.

Reporter: No one gave him a job, so he created on his own?

Professor Yuan: He can’t leave art. Suppose if he left there, he wouldn’t even be able to get some clay. He wouldn’t even be able to make small sculptures. He wasn’t in good health, but he had a strong character. Although you would see how cheerful he always was, he was in such  bad health. When we invited him to teach, he was very happy. But it was so difficult for him. He ate little at lunch, and the lunch he brought was pretty bad. He wouldn’t even come with us when we invited him out for lunch. He thought he would be a burden as he walked with a cane and with difficulty. His life was tough. But being with young people, lecturing and creating made him very happy. He was willing to interact with others.

Reporter: Do you know much about the time when he was at the Academy?

Professor Yuan: I know very little about his everyday life. His son was not bad. He bought Liu a house. Every time Liu came to teach, his son drove him to the Academy. I know that, but I’m not sure about the rest. 

Why are there so many romantic things, so many cheerful things, and so many elements that invite appreciation in his sculptures?

Reporter: He likes, but not directly… He likes operas. He often went to see operas after class, including Hebei Bangzi and other folk operas.

Professor Yuan: He likes them all.

Reporter: He likes these things, things in Chinese folk art. They played a part in his early years… some sculptures in the temple. It wouldn’t be possible for ordinary people to give up such good conditions and leave for elsewhere. He didn’t say much before leaving.
Professor Yuan: He didn’t say it directly. I still don’t know what Ma Jinfeng looked like. She was certainly very famous. The one who was comparable would be Chang Xiangyu.

Reporter: You didn’t visit him much when he was beside the electric kiln. What was it like in the kiln?

Professor Yuan: My impression is that it was a very simple room, and there was a person called Wu Jing. Wu Jing was labelled as a rightist at that time, and his circumstances were pretty bad as well. Not many places in the Academy would host him. He only taught a bit in the sculpture department, which seemed to be also around the kiln. In fact, I think his love for life had a great influence on his art.

Reporter: What do you feel?

Professor Yuan: Look at his works, look at the two sculptures he gave me. Look at this one. This one is based on Qu Yuan’s writing. A man and a woman hugging each other on the horse. For this subject, he made it very simple. You see this man and this woman are sitting naked on the horse, hugging each other, looking at each other, with both hands on each other, sitting on horseback, and the horse is galloping. And that one, I think it is an image of Sangui, also influenced by Qu Yuan’s writing. A naked body lying on the animal. Such romance and emotion, and the breath of life he pays attention to, are significant in his sculptures. What he usually creates is what he saw in his life when he was in the countryside during the Cultural Revolution. For example, a small family, a small farmhouse, and pigs raised in the farmhouse. These are inter-related. That’s why I say that there’s something pertaining to the original Chinese culture in his temperament. For example, the things he likes, such as Henan Bangzi, Hebei Bangzi, Shanxi Bangzi, all about folk, his interest in folk culture or folk legends, some stories in Chinese culture… He made a sculpture of Jigong drinking. The connection is intrinsic.

That’s why I think he actually doesn’t cover up or hide anything when he makes sculptures. One’s art is closely linked to his character. Liu is admirable in many aspects. We can see him from different perspectives. As an artist, he is invaluable. For example, his life is actually very tough, but he has an optimistic attitude. It is not that he cannot see all kinds of things, but what he leaves for others or for himself in his sculptures is often what supports him, which are the feelings, or the imagination of feelings. The connection between art and him is so close, so intrinsic, which makes his sculptures always full of vitality. I think this is something that many artists have not even been able to touch upon. Why do people like Van Gogh? It is because Van Gogh was such a person who exposed his heart. In the eye of Van Gogh, the sky was so beautiful, and the trees were like flying and blazing. In his inner world, he also saw a lot of beautiful things. Even if he couldn’t see them in reality, he imagined them. I think all these things supported his life, as a critical force that supported his survival against the adversities and illness. So, he was one with art. I think this alone is a very valuable quality of an artist.
Liu never really cares about the material things, the price, the amount. He has no interest in those. He stays away from this completely. What many people focus on is utterly dull to him. Nonetheless, the humble emotions towards farmers which are reflected in many of his sculptures were admirable. Many artists consider themselves superior to ordinary people. Liu doesn’t. He’s the same as the ordinary people, and he can feel all their joys and sorrows. 

It can be seen from his sculptures that some minor scenes in farmers’ lives are very moving to him. He stayed in the countryside for quite a long time. When he was sent there during the Cultural Revolution, he lived so closely with the farmers. He didn’t experience the countryside life as ordered with the purpose of transformation as the leaders then saw it. He didn’t have such an attitude. He was like one of the farmers. He joined in, and appreciated the opportunity to live with them, a kind of affinity.

Reporter: If he doesn’t have that kind of emotion, he wouldn’t be able to make the sculptures?

Professor Yuan: He wouldn’t, and he wouldn’t talk. All he created came from his feelings. He had a small notebook to jot down ideas. He wrote down what he wouldn’t want to forget. He’s an artist of the ordinary people. Nowadays, that’s extremely rare. Moreover, he doesn’t stand on top of the ordinary people, or point his finger at the ordinary people. He’s one of the ordinary people, one of the farmers. He is this kind of artist.

Reporter: He has academic qualifications and he’s knowledgeable. Why does he exclude himself from others? I guess it has something to do with his physical condition?

Professor Yuan: Originally, he didn’t have any disability, no. He fell ill later on in life.

Reporter: When he was beside the electric kiln, and every time you passed by and looked inside, did you see him always on his own?

Professor Yuan: In fact, I didn’t associate with him. I knew he was there, and I had seen his sculptures, the published ones. At that time, I rarely saw his sculptures, and I chatted with him only occasionally.